{"id":3348,"date":"2023-12-27T12:42:09","date_gmt":"2023-12-27T17:42:09","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/prodigymaker.com\/?p=3348"},"modified":"2024-01-10T09:33:36","modified_gmt":"2024-01-10T14:33:36","slug":"swiatek-nadal-djokovic-and-the-western-forehand-prodigy-maker-show-episode-74","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/prodigymaker.com\/index.php\/2023\/12\/27\/swiatek-nadal-djokovic-and-the-western-forehand-prodigy-maker-show-episode-74\/","title":{"rendered":"Swiatek, Nadal, Djokovic and the Western Forehand &#8211; Prodigy Maker Show Episode 74"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<figure class=\"wp-block-embed is-type-video is-provider-youtube wp-block-embed-youtube wp-embed-aspect-16-9 wp-has-aspect-ratio\"><div class=\"wp-block-embed__wrapper\">\n<span class=\"embed-youtube\" style=\"text-align:center; display: block;\"><iframe loading=\"lazy\" class=\"youtube-player\" width=\"640\" height=\"360\" src=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/embed\/Gy57-XeiyZw?version=3&#038;rel=1&#038;showsearch=0&#038;showinfo=1&#038;iv_load_policy=1&#038;fs=1&#038;hl=en-US&#038;autohide=2&#038;wmode=transparent\" allowfullscreen=\"true\" style=\"border:0;\" sandbox=\"allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-popups allow-presentation allow-popups-to-escape-sandbox\"><\/iframe><\/span>\n<\/div><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<iframe loading=\"lazy\" width=\"100%\" height=\"166\" scrolling=\"no\" frameborder=\"no\" allow=\"autoplay\" src=\"https:\/\/w.soundcloud.com\/player\/?url=https%3A\/\/api.soundcloud.com\/tracks\/1699985712&amp;color=%23ff5500&amp;auto_play=false&amp;hide_related=false&amp;show_comments=true&amp;show_user=true&amp;show_reposts=false&amp;show_teaser=true\"><\/iframe><div style=\"font-size: 10px; color: #cccccc;line-break: anywhere;word-break: normal;overflow: hidden;white-space: nowrap;text-overflow: ellipsis; font-family: Interstate,Lucida Grande,Lucida Sans Unicode,Lucida Sans,Garuda,Verdana,Tahoma,sans-serif;font-weight: 100;\"><a href=\"https:\/\/soundcloud.com\/user-174049345\" title=\"Chris Lewit\" target=\"_blank\" style=\"color: #cccccc; text-decoration: none;\" rel=\"noopener\">Chris Lewit<\/a> \u00b7 <a href=\"https:\/\/soundcloud.com\/user-174049345\/swiatek-djokovic-nadal-and-the-western-grip-prodigy-maker-show-74\" title=\"Swiatek, Djokovic, Nadal and the Western Grip - Prodigy Maker Show 74\" target=\"_blank\" style=\"color: #cccccc; text-decoration: none;\" rel=\"noopener\">Swiatek, Djokovic, Nadal and the Western Grip &#8211; Prodigy Maker Show 74<\/a><\/div>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">In Episode 74 of the Prodigy Maker Show, Chris delves into the intriguing world of modern tennis grips, focusing on the Western Forehand grip structure that has become synonymous with the success of players like Iga Swiatek, Rafael Nadal, and Novak Djokovic.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Does the success of Swiatek, Djokovic, and Nadal justify teaching the Western forehand grip?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">We have all heard warnings about the dangers of using a western grip, especially from coaches in the United States. \u201cYou will shank (miss hit) the ball too much,\u201d coaches often say. \u201cYou won\u2019t be able to handle fast-paced balls when you are older,\u201d is a common refrain. \u201cYou will miss too many low balls and be susceptible to slice backhands,\u201d is another frequent admonition. \u201cYou won\u2019t be able to produce pace and hit through your shots to make it to the big-time,\u201d the criticism continues: \u201cYou won\u2019t be able to take the ball on the rise,\u201d coaches chide. And last but not least: \u201cYou could get injured with such an extreme grip,\u201d coaches counsel. For the average parent or player listening to this constant drum-beat against the western forehand grip, you\u2019d have to be ignorant or brazen to try and teach the grip or learn it for yourself, right? Well, three of the greatest players in the world all decided to play with a western (Swiatek), or near-western grip (in the case of Djokovic and Nadal). Considering their success, perhaps the coaching world should reevaluate the merits of the western grip in today\u2019s modern game.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Our most famous coaches in the US speak very negatively about the western grip. Many say that a player limits their future if the grip slides too far. Coaches around the country, from club to academy, parrot the same talking points. Just look at the current greatest players in our game for a strong rebuttal: Iga Swiatek, dominant at #1 with three grand slams. Full western grip. Rafael Nadal, in his twilight years, but one of the greatest players ever with 22 grand slams. Near western grip. Novak Djokovic, the greatest current player with 24 grand slams. Same grip as Rafa. You would think these types of results would be impossible if you listened to the influential coaches in the media, online, or on social media. It used to be that coaches would advise, \u201cwell, you might be able to crack the top 100 with a western grip, but you\u2019ll never be great. You will never win slams or be number one.\u201d That longtime pillar of truth has been broken now with the successes of Swiatek, Nadal, and Djokovic.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>What is a Western grip?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<figure class=\"wp-block-image aligncenter size-full is-resized\"><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" data-attachment-id=\"3353\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/prodigymaker.com\/index.php\/2023\/12\/27\/swiatek-nadal-djokovic-and-the-western-forehand-prodigy-maker-show-episode-74\/racker-grip-bevels-1\/\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/prodigymaker.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/01\/Racker-Grip-Bevels-1.png?fit=600%2C400&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"600,400\" data-comments-opened=\"1\" data-image-title=\"Racker-Grip-Bevels-1\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/prodigymaker.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/01\/Racker-Grip-Bevels-1.png?fit=600%2C400&amp;ssl=1\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/prodigymaker.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/01\/Racker-Grip-Bevels-1.png?resize=441%2C294\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-3353\" width=\"441\" height=\"294\" srcset=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/prodigymaker.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/01\/Racker-Grip-Bevels-1.png?w=600&amp;ssl=1 600w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/prodigymaker.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/01\/Racker-Grip-Bevels-1.png?resize=300%2C200&amp;ssl=1 300w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 441px) 100vw, 441px\" \/><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">For those who are not very familiar with grip structure, the eastern grip is when the index knuckle is on bevel 3 (according to USPTA and PTR classification), essentially a shake hands grip (see accompanying grip diagram). It was the grip of Pete Sampras and many other top pros in the 1980s and 1990s, for example. A modified eastern forehand grip with the index knuckle between bevel 3 and 4 is sometimes referred to as a composite grip. This grip was made popular by Roger Federer and more recently, Carlos Alcaraz. The semi-western grip is currently the most popular forehand grip on both the ATP and WTA tours, and features the index knuckle on bevel 4. The western grip that Swiatek uses features the palm more under the handle and the index knuckle at bevel 5 (full-western) or bevel 6 (extreme full-western), Novak Djokovic and Rafael Nadal have a grip in between bevel 4 and bevel 5, which is what many coaches call a near-western or extreme semi-western grip.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Do Western grips cause more miss hits?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Certainly, anecdotal coaching and playing experience supports this concept. It makes sense that a player holding an eastern grip, essentially a shake-hands grips, would have a clean approach to the ball with a vertical string face making a miss hit less likely. On the other hand, the western grips angle the racquet face more downward on approach to ball impact and likely do increase the risk of a miss hit. The forearm has to rotate in an extreme way to make the racquet face vertical enough to lift the ball and create a shot trajectory that clears the net. While this added complexity certainly makes miss hits more possible with a near-western to western grip, pros like Nadal, Djokovic and Swiatek have proven that this challenge is surmountable. The incidence of miss hits is perhaps less likely in elite players who have automated their technique to an optimal level versus recreational players who are less well trained.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Western grips make it difficult to handle low balls such as slice backhands<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">This is not a myth, and keeping the ball low against a western or near-western grip player is an excellent strategy. Low balls are typically hard to handle with the very closed racquet face orientation found in western grips. This is definitely a go-to game plan against a player with an extreme western grip, western, near-western grip. I\u2019m surprised that no player on the WTA tour has been able to effectively hurt Swiatek by attacking her forehand with low slice or flat shots. It may have been serendipitous for Iga that Ash Barty, with her exceptional slice backhand, retired from the game at a young age, leaving Swiatek to dominate the pro circuit. With the balls and courts getting slower and with higher rebounds, this strategy may not be as effective on the pro tour as in the past, when many tournaments were on grass and fast hard courts.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Western grips make it hard to produce depth and pace<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">In my experience as a technician and high performance coach, the extreme western (near bevel 6) can sometimes limit a player\u2019s ability to hit through the ball with depth and pace. With western (bevel 5) and semi-western (bevel 4) grips, I\u2019ve observed that players can still hit with optimal power and depth, especially if they are muscularly explosive with good amounts of fast-twitch muscle fibers. It\u2019s probably not a myth that some western grip players can have trouble hitting cleanly through the ball to generate high amounts of MPH, but they are likely less physiologically powerful to begin with. After enough practice, I have found that most players with western or near-western grips, unless they are petite and lacking fast-twitch fibers, are able to drive through the ball with power. The extreme western grip is really the most limiting in terms of being able to generate pace and depth without a miss hit.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Western grips make is difficult to take the ball on the rise<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">It is true that the more extreme grips can affect the player\u2019s ability to take the ball on the rise. This makes intuitive sense because on-the-rise balls are often played at low impact points. Combine low impacts, a fast incoming shot, and an extreme grip that closes the racquet face towards the ground on approach, and miss hits or difficulties getting under ball can certainly happen. It seems that Nadal, Swiatek, and Djokovic have managed to ameliorate that potential liability with excellent footwork, low body position, and quick racquet face adjustments with the wrist and forearm. Sometimes simply playing deeper in the court can help, and you see a lot of men in today\u2019s game playing deeper behind the baseline without negative effects. Sometimes players, despite their western grip structure, manage to learn to meet the ball early and on the rise with little difficulty, if they practice the skill enough times and gain mastery.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Western grips have a higher rate of injury<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">A scientific literature search did not find any evidence in journal articles that western grips lead to a higher prevalence of injury in elite players. There is some evidence that recreational western grip players can have more injuries to the ulnar side of the wrist (Reid et al., 2013). Again, as noted above, it\u2019s important to differentiate between very well-trained players and recreational players with lower levels of training. It makes intuitive sense that the ligaments and musculotendinous units in the wrist and forearm would receive more loading when a player hits with a western grip, but high-level athletes may be able to withstand these forces without serious consequence. Anecdotally, in over 25 years of tennis coaching, I have not seen a higher incidence of wrist injuries in semi-western and western grip players as compared to more conservative grip players. Rafa, Novak, and Iga seem to have been durable in regards to their wrist. It seems that wrist injuries can affect conservative grip players (like Del Potro) as much as western grip players at the pro level. More scientific research is needed to determine what the exact risks are for players using a western grip, if any, and to quantify those risks if they exist.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>What are the advantages of a more western grip?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">People don\u2019t often hype the advantages of the western grip. They usually focus on the potential negatives. What makes the forehand of Iga and Rafa so special and dominant? It\u2019s the topspin of course! The western and near western grips allow a player to hit a very heavy ball with high spin rates. That is a major advantage on the forehand in today\u2019s modern game, where a powerful topspin forehand can be the most important weapon in a match. The grip also helps to handle high bouncing balls on the receiving end as well\u2013another benefit. Every commentator and spectator marvel at Swiatek\u2019s heavy topspin forehand attack, but few junior coaches in the trenches will ever let a kid experiment with her style of full western grip. That disconnect doesn\u2019t feel right to me! Does it seem right to you?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>A reconceptualization of what makes a \u201cbad grip\u201d may be needed!<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I would wager that the majority of coaches\u2013when working with a young kid\u2013would be quick to change a near-western grip like the ones that Djokovic and Nadal use successfully, and almost all coaches in the US would change a young kid who showed up on court with Swiatek\u2019s full western grip. That\u2019s a shame because perhaps we should reevaluate what a bad forehand grip is exactly. Perhaps the dynamics of today\u2019s modern pro game have shifted, and a near-western (at bevel 4\u20445) or a full-western (at bevel 5) grip are now more viable at the top levels of the game, especially considering that court speed at most venues has slowed, balls have been slowed, and bounces tend to be higher, even on the grass courts at Wimbledon. The success of Swiatek, Nadal, and Djokovic support this conclusion. Perhaps the collective ire of coaches world-wide should be refocused on the extreme western-grip (bevel 6), which has never been viable at the pro level, except for very rare occasions (Alberto Berasetegui), and seems to offer more risk of miss hits and possible injury, and increases the severity of all the potential disadvantages that have been discussed above.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">In my own coaching practice, working with many of the top players in the country and building the foundations of many serious kids, I encourage the semi-western grip as the most well-rounded grip, but when my players shift a little farther, I only change it after a detailed discussion with the parents and player about the potential risks, and potential positives and negatives. I certainly don\u2019t want to be the coach who negatively impacts the trajectory of a future Novak, Rafa, or Iga by messing with a kid\u2019s preferred way of holding the racquet on arguably the most important shot in the game. At the same time, I am more quick to change an extreme western grip at bevel 6, which is really extreme, and has not been proven successful at the pro level by many players.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Key Notes:<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\">\n<li>The rise of Swiatek, the first number 1 with a Western grip. <\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>The success of Djokovic and Nadal, with near-western grips. <\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>Should the parameters for acceptable grip structures be expanded? <\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>Is a Bevel 5 western grip workable in today\u2019s modern game. <\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>Is a Bevel 6 western trip too extreme? <\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>Will the future of tennis be more extreme grips closer to Bevel 5? <\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>Advantages of the western grip <\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>Disadvantages of the western grip <\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>Myths about the western grip <\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>Advice for coaches and players regarding grips for the forehand<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Join Chris as he dissects the nuances of these gripping tales, offering insights into the world of professional tennis and the evolving strategies that shape the game. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Whether you&#8217;re a coach, player, or tennis enthusiast, this episode is a must-watch for anyone looking to stay ahead in the ever-changing landscape of tennis techniques.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>References<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<ol class=\"wp-block-list\">\n<li>Reid, M., Elliott, B., &amp; Crespo, M. (2013). Mechanics and learning practices associated with the tennis forehand: a review. Journal of Sports Science &amp; Medicine, 12(2), 225\u2013231<\/li>\n<\/ol>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><strong>SwingVision: Learn &#8211; Play &#8211; Enjoy<\/strong><\/h2>\n\n\n\n<figure class=\"wp-block-embed is-type-video is-provider-youtube wp-block-embed-youtube wp-embed-aspect-16-9 wp-has-aspect-ratio\"><div class=\"wp-block-embed__wrapper\">\n<span class=\"embed-youtube\" style=\"text-align:center; display: block;\"><iframe loading=\"lazy\" class=\"youtube-player\" width=\"640\" height=\"360\" src=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/embed\/FwnGdX5JzxE?version=3&#038;rel=1&#038;showsearch=0&#038;showinfo=1&#038;iv_load_policy=1&#038;fs=1&#038;hl=en-US&#038;autohide=2&#038;wmode=transparent\" allowfullscreen=\"true\" style=\"border:0;\" sandbox=\"allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-popups allow-presentation allow-popups-to-escape-sandbox\"><\/iframe><\/span>\n<\/div><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Track your shots in real-time using just your smartphone, and get detailed statistics and video analysis.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\">\n<li>Evaluate your performance<\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>Track your progress<\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>Improve instantly<\/li>\n\n\n\n<li>Play like the pros<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Get discounted subscription offer: <strong><a href=\"https:\/\/swing.vision\/r\/TEAMCLTA\">GET SWINGVISION<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Check out some of our most popular episodes:<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><a href=\"https:\/\/youtu.be\/KrtaLfOWauI\">Billy Jean King\u2019s Eye Coach Review<\/a><br><a href=\"https:\/\/youtu.be\/e9s8JWQxskg\">555 Tennis Serve Drill<\/a><br><a href=\"https:\/\/youtu.be\/Ytz4QZs0nOY\">Does Djokovic\u2019s Defeat of Tsitsipas Foretell Death For The One-Handed Backhand?<\/a><br><a href=\"https:\/\/youtu.be\/SRIYjch3Coc\">Alcaraz, Nadal, and the Secret of Spanish Tennis Footwork<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity is-style-wide\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Follow Chris at these websites and social media links:<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Visit&nbsp;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.chrislewit.com\/\">Chris Lewit Tennis Academy Website<\/a><br>Visit the&nbsp;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.prodigymaker.com\/\">Prodigy Maker Show Blog<\/a><br><a href=\"http:\/\/www.facebook.com\/ChrisLewitTennisAcademy\">Chris Lewit Tennis Academy Facebook<\/a><br>Follow us on&nbsp;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.twitter.com\/chrislewit\">Twitter<\/a><br>Connect with us on&nbsp;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.linkedin.com\/company\/chris-lewit-tennis-academy\">LinkedIn<\/a><br>Follow us on&nbsp;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.instagram.com\/chrislewittennis\/\">Instagram<\/a><br>Subscribe to our&nbsp;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.youtube.com\/ChrisLewit\">YouTube<\/a>&nbsp;channel<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>In Episode 74 of the Prodigy Maker Show, Chris delves into the intriguing world of modern tennis grips, focusing on the Western Forehand grip structure that has become synonymous with the success of players like Iga Swiatek, Rafael Nadal, and Novak Djokovic.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":3349,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"om_disable_all_campaigns":false,"_monsterinsights_skip_tracking":false,"site-container-style":"default","site-container-layout":"default","site-sidebar-layout":"default","disable-article-header":"default","disable-site-header":"default","disable-site-footer":"default","disable-content-area-spacing":"default","_jetpack_newsletter_access":"","_jetpack_dont_email_post_to_subs":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_tier_id":0,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paywalled_content":false,"_jetpack_feature_clip_id":0,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":true,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","default_image_id":0,"font":"","enabled":false},"version":2},"jetpack_post_was_ever_published":false},"categories":[318],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-3348","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-prodigy-maker-show-high-performance-tennis-talk"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v28.7 - 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